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VermontHunter

Loose Powder Questions

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OK, so I'm finally going to give loose powder a go, my question/s is what Brand to use and what grade. I've been looking at either the Hodgdon Triple 7 or the Blackhorn 209. The next thing is what should I be using in my .50 Cal. TC Triumph ... FFG or FFFG ?? I'm even going to try a new round, I've picked up some Federal Premium 270grn. B.O.R. Lock's. The hype on these are that they are a super great round out to 200 yrds. NOT, that I'm ever intentionally looking to shoot at this distance. I will be looking more at the penetration of this round vs, the Powerbelt Platinum .270 grn. round. Any info or suggestion would be greatly appreciated .... :)

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Using 115 grains triple 7 with the accura here Luke, with the 240 grain xtp mags. That is ffg. Not tried the blackhorn in my gun, be sure your gun is safe to use blackhorn, the TC black diamond is not. Don't remember the exact muzzle velocity of that cva accura combination off the top of my head, but thinking it was close to around 2100 fps. At that it is easily a 200 yard gun, have killed a few deer around 170-180 yards with it and popped a few yotes near that distance too. Using a prostaff bdc scope the second dot on my setup is pretty well on at 175. The black diamond still using pyro rs also an ffg and running 120 grains loose powder. Not quite the muzzle velocity of the cva, but close. Saw the bor locks at walmart the other day, let us know how those work out.

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William according to TC's chart for my Triumph using a 250 -300 grn. bullet with 150 grns of pyrodex pellets the muzzle velocity is between 2680 - 2762 ft. pounds of velocity. I have always used 150 grns. ( 3 Pellets ) for a charge.

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[QUOTE=VermontHunter;2056889]William according to TC's chart for my Triumph using a 250 -300 grn. bullet with 150 grns of pyrodex pellets the muzzle velocity is between 2680 - 2762 ft. pounds of velocity.

I have always used 150 grns. ( 3 Pellets ) for a charge.[/QUOTE]

Muzzle velocity or muzzle energy?

The triple 7 can best as i remember shows like 1800 some odd feet per second velocity with a 250 grain sabot and 100 grain powder charge. I will have to run downstairs and look.

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Sorry about that ,, that would be Muzzle Energy. Think I may have found something on there site ,, According to TC ,, using 150 grs. of loose FFG black powder with a 250gr Shockwave will produce 1853 FPS of Muzzle Velocity and 1907 ft. lbs. of Muzzle Energy. But it doesn't say what brand Black Powder they are using. [B][COLOR=#ffffff]ONT=Helvetica-Condensed-Bold][SIZE=1][COLOR=#ffffff][FONT=Helvetica-Condensed-Bold][SIZE=1][COLOR=#ffffff]150 grs. FFG 1853 F.P.S. 1907 Ft. Lbs.[/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FON[/COLOR][/B] Edited by VermontHunter

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Triple 7 on the can shows 1820 feet per second for a 250 grain 44 cal sabot with 100 grain powder charge.

I ran some through the chrony last fall and pretty sure my setup with the cva and 115 grains triple 7 was around 2100 and the black diamond with 120 grains pyro rs was not quite as fast. The cva has a longer barrel and the triple 7 is more efficient. That being said the black diamond is more accurate with the pyrodex than it is with triple 7, but i was not using 209's with it because they are a bit of a pain to deal with under the scope on that setup.

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Should be fine Luke. Triple 7 should be more efficient than pyro.

Depending on how much powder you use you should be able to work up a load with a good velocity and accuracy. I usually start at 100 grains and work up in 5 grain increments until groups open up then back back down.
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If you don't already have any be sure you get magnum powder quick loaders. TC sells the plastic quick loaders that hold powder in one side with a holder for your primer/percussion cap and your sabot in the other side with a bullet starter. There are non magnum powder quick loaders out there too and they may not hold enough. We use these [url]https://www.amazon.com/Thompson-Center-Loader-Bullet-Starter/dp/B00YXR2Q4Y[/url]

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Well, the Triple 7 loose powder and the B.O.R. Locks were a total bust. Just couldn't get any type of accuracy no matter what I tried. Just mu opinion the B.O.R. Locks are junk.

So one of my buddy's suggested I try the Blackhorn 209 ,, So I bite the proverbial bullet and go a buy some Blackhorn, 240grn. Superglide Shockwaves, and some new primers ( CCI Magnums ) just to be on the safe side.

I go the range and setup 110 grns. of Blackhorn and ram a shockwave down the barrel and prime the breech. I settle in on the bench rest and line up the 100 yrd. target and pull the trigger and all I get is a pop. So here I am holding my ML for dear life waiting for this thing to go off ( not  great feeling ) so after waiting a couple minutes I pull the breech plug and empty the powder out and push the round out. I clean everything one more time and reload everything as I did previously. I settle in on the rest and line up on the target and pull the trigger, this time it goes off as it should and hits the target abit high and right.

I adjust the scope accordingly and reload, this time after pulling the trigger I get a freakin' delayed ignition. I'm thinking to myself this can't be happening, frustration is a understatement at this point. I reload again and settle in an pull the trigger and it fires as it should and this round actually hit the bullseye. So I decide to reload and try one more, yep you got it, the thing just goes pop and nothing. So I unload and head home just purely disgusted.
I get home and do some internet research, I start at the Blackhorn 209 website. Behold they have a whole article on particular breech plugs that have inconsistent spec issues with the flash channel and fire channel. so I email TC with the said article attached. I wait for 6 days with no response. My buddy calls and asks how I made out at the range, he instantly knows I'm not a happy camper. He said meet me at the range with your stuff in 5 minutes. So I gather everything up and we meet at the range.

He tells me to do everything I did prior, so I measure out 110 grns. of Blackhorn ( tapping it to be sure it's settled and giving me an accurate reading ) I then ram a shockwave and prime the breech with a CCI primer. I the settle into the rest and pull the trigger, NOTHING !! So now I'm PO'd bigtime. He calms me down and says, take that primer out, and he hands me one of his Winchester 209 shots shell primers and says try again, Boooom, bullseye on the target. He says reload, I do and don't you know it, it doesn't go off again, he hands me another one of his primers and I try again, Boooom the round hits almost in the same spot. I reload again but this time I use another one of his Winchester primers and perfect ignition, I now have a clover leaf on the target. I reload one more time and get yet another perfect ignition and a good shot on the target.
So we don't get lost as to why I went through all of this misery is that I couldn't ram 2 consecutive shock waves down my Triumph using Triple 7 Pellets, and the Powerbelts just weren't doing what I needed. And besides I figured I should be able to use a TC product in a TC. I am now able to ram up to 8 rounds with having to swab or clean between reloads.

Oh, yeah remember that non response to my email. I went to Thompson Centers facebook page and let them know of my displeasure with their lack of response, I got a inbox within the hour asking for my address so they could send me a NEW updated breech plug, and they even over-nighted it to my surprise. It's just to bad someone has to get upset on social media to get a response from a company.

So this is what I ended up with ...

110 grns. of Blackhorn 209

240 grn. Superglide Shockwave

Winchester 209 Shot Shell Primers

and one zeroed in  TC Triumph ready for ML Season action.

 

P.S.

Sorry for the book ... lol

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6 hours ago, Strut10 said:

Sounds like you're good and ready to start with a flintlock, now................... !!!!     :rolleyes:

I think a Flintlock would be just out of my league .. lol I'm just getting the hang of this black powder stuff, I got a way's to go before the Flintlock stuff. :)

They do sound fund to shoot tho.

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while back i was going on an out of state muzzleloader hunt. i contacted blackhorn and got a great response back.  had illustrated directions for my gun and what to look for that could kill accuracy. basically they said it's particular with what primers it likes.  also carefully use a certain drill bit size in your fingers to get build up out of the flash channel to keep it to exact spec.  problem is i couldn't find it anywhere.  anyone i know that uses it gets awesome results though.

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On ‎12‎/‎21‎/‎2016 at 9:07 AM, dbHunterNY said:

while back i was going on an out of state muzzleloader hunt. i contacted blackhorn and got a great response back.  had illustrated directions for my gun and what to look for that could kill accuracy. basically they said it's particular with what primers it likes.  also carefully use a certain drill bit size in your fingers to get build up out of the flash channel to keep it to exact spec.  problem is i couldn't find it anywhere.  anyone i know that uses it gets awesome results though.

Blackhorn is awesome, they with TC helped guide me through my troubles ( mostly on my part ). TC sent me a spanking new breechplug for my Triumph free of charge without charging me for it, and Blackhorn gave me a complete guide on how to use and clean Blackhorn 209. I haven't had a single problem since.

Here is a link to Blackhorns recommendations on use and cleaning ..

http://www.blackhorn209.com/specs/ignition-guidelines/

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